PGT - Canucks-3: NYRefs-4: Shit happens.

[stawns]

Just now, Ghostsof1915 said:

I know Ferraro gets flak at times. But he had a great idea on refs and the rulebook. He said before the season starts. Get two reps from each team. And all the linesmen and refs together. And go through the rule book. If there's rules are clear, you don't review them. But the ones everyone has issues with. Discuss them. That way before the season starts they can get everyone on the same page. On what is and isn't a penalty. It's not going to stop missed calls. But at least it should provide the players and refs consistency on what the rules are.

Until the puck drops and refs have a fraction of a second to decide call/not call.  

 

80ish officials in the league, you're never going to get even half who see things remotely the same way 

[Darth Canuck]

8 hours ago, JamesB said:

Caught the game late.

 

1. If on Friday morning you had offered me 3 points out of 4 from a tough back to back I would have jumped at it.

 

2. And, not only that, but the Canucks completely dominated a decent St. Louis team and then arguably outplayed a rested team viewed by many as a legitimate Cup contender. 

 

3. I think the Canucks were the better team at 5-on-5 by the eye test and certainly in the numbers. Obviously the Rangers' two PP goals with a 5-3 advantage and a questionable OT goal were the difference. 

 

4. Nothing more to be said about the OT goal. It looked like a missed call (tripping  Petey) that led to a 3-on-1 breakout and the winning goal. But I can see how it was missed. It was a fairly close call that would have needed slow-motion replay to be sure. As several people have said, it might make sense to review OT goals. It seems particularly unfortunate after the Rangers benefited from two 5-on-3 situations and the apparent missed call.

 

5. Lots of positives tonight. Great to see Myers continuing to play well. He was up to 18 minutes tonight and was not "sheltered".  Hronek was excellent--looking more and more like a great trade acquisition. And Petey's line was very good. Kuzy was unlucky not to score tonight.

 

6. DeSmith gave up 4 goals on 24 shots but it is hard to complain about any of the goals. It would have great if he could have come up with one more big save but I don't think we could reasonably expect much more. Shesterkin was excellent at the other end.

 

Bottom line: It was a close game, but the Canucks were a bit unlucky to come away with only one point.

 

With 10% of the season gone, things are looking pretty good so far.

 

 

The Dark Side agrees with every point you make! Especially points 1, 2, and 3. Thanks for yet another good synopsis!

[-dlc-]

7 minutes ago, stawns said:

I guess I just don't see how you're going to get consistency when there are 80ish officials who all see things from their own perspective and call the game their way.

 

Players know every official, they know who calls the game which way and that's always how it's been, all the way back to minor hockey.  It's up to the players to know and adjust to every individual ref, same as they adjust to individual players.

 

Thats hockey 

This is such crap..."the way it's always been". So nothing changes or evolves over time? Players also never used to wear helmets and smoked and draink in the locker rooms pre game. Big heavy wooden sticks were used. Things change over time.

 

So rookies coming into the league should "know" the refs? Where do they get the fact sheet prior to the game to learn about the individual? 

 

They should know the rules of the game. Period.

 

And "they know who and which way". They should all have "the same way" in reference to knowing what's a penalty and what's not. Not subjective, by the book.

 

Excuses, that's what I'm hearing.

[Alflives]

8 minutes ago, -dlc- said:

Not if they all follow the same guidelines and don't let personal preference and team history come into play, which they tend to do. Carry over shouldn't be a thing...clean slates and each game is reffed based on what happens there. Sure, some repeat offenders may get a closer look but even that is a joke when you have Marchand's celebrated in the league.

 

It's piss poor and consistency in a professional league should be the standard and what's strived for....not something "impossible because". 

 

Anyhow, I'm glad the team is accepting that this is their fate (inconsistent refs) and don't rely on them to get it right. Sad that they have to adjust instead of the refs getting paid to do the job at a professional level having to maybe review how they're doing things. No accountability or explanation...just barrel along.

 

 

It would be interesting to see officials take questions after games. Might be boring, only league approved answers though. 
I wonder what the canned answers would be?

[PhillipBlunt]

1 hour ago, stawns said:

Cute, but it's a serious question.  Do you think there are a pool of better officials out there?

Yeah. They’re officials who work international games for a start. Those games are called with far greater consistency than the dreck who call NHL games. International refs would have called the obvious infraction that blatantly occurred right in front of them.
 

To think that the gobsmacked ref that was looking right at the play (you know, following the puck) while Pettersson was blatantly tripped, is the cream of the crop of hockey officiating is ridiculous and sad. There’s a reason criticism of officials in the NHL is met with a fine. C’mon buddy. Think a little. 

Edited October 29, 2023 by PhillipBlunt

[PhillipBlunt]

3 minutes ago, Alflives said:

It would be interesting to see officials take questions after games. Might be boring, only league approved answers though. 
I wonder what the canned answers would be?

The league would never let that happen. They protect the officials by fining any player or coach who even criticizes them. Does that seem like a league with nothing to hide?

[Rekker]

41 minutes ago, igorwasgreat said:

He took the high road, something to the effect “ it’s a tough job to be a ref, I couldn’t do it, we have the best refs in this league “ I don’t do the exchange justice, it was on “after hours” 

Man, Tochett has ice in his veins. It took a real leader to be calm in that situation, and this kind of response may pay off down the road. I can really admire the coach for this, I wish I had the same self-control.

[PhillipBlunt]

7 minutes ago, -dlc- said:

This is such crap..."the way it's always been". So nothing changes or evolves over time? Players also never used to wear helmets and smoked and draink in the locker rooms pre game. Big heavy wooden sticks were used. Things change over time.

 

So rookies coming into the league should "know" the refs? Where do they get the fact sheet prior to the game to learn about the individual? 

 

They should know the rules of the game. Period.

 

And "they know who and which way". They should all have "the same way" in reference to knowing what's a penalty and what's not. Not subjective, by the book.

 

Excuses, that's what I'm hearing.

There will always be those who’ll seek to make excuses. 

1 minute ago, Rekker said:

Man, Tochett has ice in his veins. It took a real leader to be calm in that situation, and this kind of response may pay off down the road. I can really admire the coach for this, I wish I had the same self-control.

He knows he’s coaching the better team. And Laviolette had to wipe his chin. 

[-dlc-]

3 minutes ago, PhillipBlunt said:

Yeah. They’re officials who work international games for a start. Those games are called with far greater consistency than the dreck who call NHL games. International refs would have called the obvious infraction that blatantly occurred right in front of them.
 

To think that the gobsmacked ref that was looking right at the play (you know, following the puck) while Pettersson was blatantly tripped, is the cream of the crop of hockey officiating is ridiculous and sad. There’s a reason criticism of officials on the NHL is met with a fine. C’mon buddy. Think a little. 

Besides, "there's no one better?" The top league in the world and this is what we should accept?

 

Is that a response that the NHL should offer? "Sorry, all we've got"?

 

Make them be better...they're getting paid at the top level so insist that they perform as such. But you know, the league's likely quite happy with the refs they put on the ice and the "agendas" (which is what "getting to know the refs hints at) they have.

[PhillipBlunt]

Just now, -dlc- said:

Besides, "there's noone better?"

 

Is that a response that the NHL should accept?

 

Make them be better...they're getting paid at the top level so insist that they perform as such. But you know, the league's likely quite happy with the refs they put on the ice and the "agendas" (which is what "getting to know the refs hints at) they have.

Exactly. Why else would the league fine any player or coach who actually calls there work into question?

[-dlc-]

8 minutes ago, Rekker said:

Man, Tochett has ice in his veins. It took a real leader to be calm in that situation, and this kind of response may pay off down the road. I can really admire the coach for this, I wish I had the same self-control.

Yep, it's the way it has to be. Suck it up and work through it as best you can. Prepare for it.

 

Expect the worst and be happy if you get something better. Which isn't really ideal or satisfactory.

 

There's only SO much control the refs can have over a game...and this team is learning to play beyond the shitty calls and non calls. That's the key here...the refs get to slink away and that's not changing. I'm super happy with this team and how they're responding to the gong show.

[-dlc-]

And before we hear the comments that we're "whining about the refs"...remember, some whine that the refs have it "so hard". 

[Rekker]

3 minutes ago, -dlc- said:

Yep, it's the way it has to be. Suck it up and work through it as best you can. Prepare for it.

 

Except the worst and be happy if you get something better.

 

There's only SO much control the refs can have over a game...and this team is learning to play beyond the shitty calls and non calls. That's the key here...the refs get to slink away and that's not changing.

Yip. That said, and what I said, wouldn't you have loved to have seen Coach Crawfords response to the non call? Lol. 

[Joe King]

I think the refs are hesitant to call a penalty in overtime making it a 3 on 2.

I think any overtime goal should have a quick review. And if the goal is scored because of a light infraction it should be called back and the face off in the guilty teams end. But definitely call major infractions like boarding and head shots.

[Grandmaster]

11 hours ago, WHL rocks said:

Great game.

We were 1/6 on PP

NYR 3/6

 

Special teams was the difference but considering we played back to back against a very strong, fast team it was a good night 

That’s not telling the whole story. Their power play were constant and ridiculous 2 man advantage while we were only up by one. We also got ripped off in OT where we ought to have had a legit power play. 

[Alflives]

3 minutes ago, Joe King said:

I think the refs are hesitant to call a penalty in overtime making it a 3 on 2.

I think any overtime goal should have a quick review. And if the goal is scored because of a light infraction it should be called back and the face off in the guilty teams end. But definitely call major infractions like boarding and head shots.

I think it is a 4 on three in OT

[Mando27]

Didn't watch the game last night but looking at the highlights the Canucks played well. Shame that the game was decided on a questionable non call. Can't complain about getting the extra point though and love to see that people are getting fired up about this team again. You know the Canucks are getting good again when the biggest complaints are about the refs .

[tas]

34 minutes ago, Alflives said:

It would be interesting to see officials take questions after games. Might be boring, only league approved answers though. 
I wonder what the canned answers would be?

I keep seeing this suggested all over the place, that officials should have to face the media, and I don't get the point really. the legitimate answer to every question is "I called it like I saw it".

 

as far as I can tell people just want an opportunity to vent their rage. 

[Ballisticsports]

11 hours ago, -dlc- said:

Give this team a fair playing field and we beat them. They (NYR) get a lot of help.

I was concerned and said the same thing of this happening (mentioned it in PTSC)

I also thought I had pvr set to automatic record and missed the game

[-dlc-]

7 minutes ago, tas said:

I keep seeing this suggested all over the place, that officials should have to face the media, and I don't get the point really. the legitimate answer to every question is "I called it like I saw it".

 

as far as I can tell people just want an opportunity to vent their rage. 

But they didn't see it...so I want them to tell me why. An obvious take down that they should've seen. They saw a slash that, even in replay, I found hard to find.

 

The point isn't really to hear the answers...it's to make them answer. And "I called it like I saw it" could be questioned further, as in AfterHours when it's a bit more than one generic response.

[Devron]

Feels like we got the short end of the stick here.

 

That said we played a high end team and we played them well. Even out played them if it weren’t for the penalties. 
 

They had to score on 2 x 5 on 3’s to win this game.

 

Proud of the boys. Second game of a back to back and we held our own. I like the looks of our team this year 

[spook007]

2 hours ago, stawns said:

Cute, but it's a serious question.  Do you think there are a pool of better officials out there?

Probably not, but then the way games are being refereed should be maybe be changed...

Its was not a hard penalty to spot... so slashing can be called/missed or interferences etc... but a blatant incidents that decides a hockey game is poor...

 

It took two replays (1 from each angle to clearly spot the trip).... They have people sitting watching the game on monitors everywhere, so there really is no excuse for not getting calls like these correct... 

 

To say poor decisions are ok because other refs aren't any better, doesn't make sense... 

I don't think the refs were poor in general, although the 5 on 3 because of the too many men was a bit dodgy at best..... although correct'ish by the letter of the law

[-dlc-]

Anyhow, (almost) over it...want to be positive this year and the refs aren't part of that. I don't buy that they can't be better (and should be), but that's on them.

 

My team is awesome and I feel that they're acquiring the tools to face this kind of adversity and rise above it. Rather than to wither. 

 

We have a great core...I've always known that. Especially when you see how they're bonding and JT is a big part of that. Quinn's a perfect leader...leads on the ice by example and JT's the vocal leader. Petey's our best (along with Demko). It's nice to have these guys in place and they're learning how to win as a team. Because that's how they play (as a team).

 

Screw the Rangers, they've been put on notice. Even with the refs' help they aren't going to just roll over us.

[-dlc-]

Just now, spook007 said:

Probably not, but then the way games are being refereed should be maybe be changed...

Its was not a hard penalty to spot... so slashing can be called/missed or interferences etc... but a blatant incidents that decides a hockey game is poor...

 

It took two replays (1 from each angle to clearly spot the trip).... They have people sitting watching the game on monitors everywhere, so there really is no excuse for not getting calls like these correct... 

 

To say poor decisions are ok because other refs aren't any better, doesn't make sense... 

I don't think the refs were poor in general, although the 5 on 3 because of the too many men was a bit dodgy at best..... although correct'ish by the letter of the law

Imagine having that mentality in any other job.

 

"Well, they're not the greatest but they're the best we've got". A good company would work with them to be better...they represent your brand.

[Ballisticsports]

1 hour ago, 27 Percent said:

I want some more angry dudes. When miller went off he basically fought an entire line. Bowser and kuzy just kind of did nothing. Big or small I want someone else with some fire.

Unfortunately BB never goes in to aid his teammates and that part of his game bugs me the most, those are the guys who set him up

Needs passion, desire  and caring for his teammates more than just goals to elevate the team- you can't carry too many of these types of players on your team