[PGT] Dallas @ Vancouver

[BestCanuck]

15 minutes ago, Canuck You said:

 

 

Awe he’s so grown up now Damn how far him and Brady have come, young captains of Canadian of franchises Pipe dream seeing them duke it out some point in finals

 

And Fok, talking about his defense now! 
 

 

Edited November 5, 2023 by BestCanuck

[Bure10Kuzmenko96]

35 minutes ago, Inkidu said:

 

It's getting to where it doesn't matter if the Oilers win or lose. 

We want them to lose. More points for us is better

[AatuD2]

1 hour ago, AatuD2 said:

 

Miller's deal is so good right now, and it might help keep Petey's deal down. 

 

We have three very important deals coming up and if we can knock them out of the park, we will be one young RHD, and two young forwards away from becoming a 5 year contender.  

 

1. Petey signs for less then 11 million. 

2. Hronek signs for less then 7 million. 

3. Ian Cole comes back for 3.5 million. 

 

4. One of Hunter or Willander becomes a long term 2nd pairing RHD. 

5. Two of Podz, Lekerimakki, Bains, Raty, or Forsell make it as impact middle 6 players. 

 

I'm cautiously optimistic that Boeser and Myers realize that they've been overpaid and take cheap deals to stay with us. Myers is totally fine as a 6th/7th dman for 2.5 million, not for 6 million. 

 

 

1 hour ago, stawns said:

The only realistic one there is cole.  

 

 

Without getting into too much hair splitting, I would say that 

 

1. For 50/50 against 

2. 50/50 

3. 80/20 

4. 80/20 

5. 20/80 

 

It's really not out of the realm of possibilities that Petey takes 10.5, Hronek takes 6.75, and that we get one NHL dman between Brusztewich and Willander. 

 

Pastrnak, the 60 goal scorer, is a nice top ceiling for Petey at 11.25, and Toews is a nice cap for Hronek at 7.25. 

[Rubik]

LOL

 

 

 

Edited November 5, 2023 by Rubik

[Smashian Kassian]

4 hours ago, Wilbur said:

Drance is kinda the modern day Tony Gallagher.  They both have/had high expectations of the team and give praise very sparingly, so when they do give it, you know it's earned.  It's like they demand perfection in a sport where perfection is near impossible but if you view them with that lens it takes the sting out of their criticisms (because of course they're going to find something to criticize because it's hard to be perfect in hockey).

 

Perhaps I'm in the minority here, but I value Drance's perspective.  Doesn't mean I always agree with it (like at all).  But I find, if you take their criticisms with a grain of salt, there's an interesting perspective there.  Just be prepared to bring a lot of salt 

 

 

The problem with Drance is he's insufferably self-focused about it. It makes him annoying to listen too. Like I try to listen to their podcast sometimes & rarely can I get through half the show before I have to turn it off.

 

When it comes to the opinions, I do find there are often double standards that he tries to talk himself around & I disagree about your high expectations comment b/c I feel like he would be like this with any team he covers. For example the other day he was trying to say Anaheim is a good team (literally) and Jamie Dodd had to stop him in his tracks & point out their underlying numbers aren't good (isn't this the line of thinking Drance was using to undermine any success we've had the last few years?)

 

I appreciate his work, I even want to like him, and I enjoy the times when I do agree completey, but.. he's trying to sell his hockey worldview to his readers & I don't find him to be the hockey genius he presents himself as. Infact I often wonder if some of his opinions are formed by going to natural stat-trick & working backwards. 

 

 

Edited November 5, 2023 by Smashian Kassian

[AatuD2]

49 minutes ago, kilgore said:

 

Yes we did. If you take into consideration our lack of top picks already traded away. On another team that sacrifice of a 1st and 2nd may not be as costly.Still, no other team jumped at that ask. Again, I'm fine with a slight overpayment, because we needed him for our "all in" plan. Just don't do that too often.

 

 

We just watched Nils Lundkvist yesterday. He cost a late 1st and a 4th round pick. 

Not even close to Hronek's quality, and smaller. 

 

Look at the Romanov and Chychrun costs. 

 

You can't hypothetically talk about "no other team jumped on it" unless you were a fly on the wall in Yzerman's office or had his phone tapped. 

[AatuD2]

1 hour ago, Bob Long said:

 

but Detoilet stuck him with Maatta for 1/2 the time and made him carry the hardest match ups. And expected him to be physical too. 

 

We're letting him shine in the top pair here. 

 

Yzergod figured he was expendable. 

 

I get too what Yzerman was trying to do. He explained in his trade deadline press conference that Detroit wasn't at the same stage as Ottawa and Buffalo, they were a couple of years behind and would delay going for it. 

[Gawdzukes]

1 hour ago, WHL rocks said:

It is planned. Phoenix is a big city and has national level appeal in the US.

 

Having a team in Phoenix is more about the whole of the NHL being more legitimate in the US. Not the local market.

 

When there's a game on tv the national audience in the US see Phoenix vs LA differently than Calgary vs LA. Phoenix brings national attention even though the locals don't follow or watch their team. 

 

Ice hockey is just not a hot weather city sport. People don't connect with it or relate to it. But for the NHL it's important to have a team in a major US city like Phienox. It's better for the league as a whole. 

Exactly. People get on this Bettman's team blah blah but I find they're missing the point completely which you've explained very well. You obviously want to try to grow the game across a country that size in order to maximize your product. It's a very reasonable strategy. It's unfortunate they've had so many struggles there of course but jumping ship wouldn't have necessarily been a grand slam or they would have moved on a long time ago.

[Johngould21]

1 hour ago, WHL rocks said:

It is planned. Phoenix is a big city and has national level appeal in the US.

 

Having a team in Phoenix is more about the whole of the NHL being more legitimate in the US. Not the local market.

 

When there's a game on tv the national audience in the US see Phoenix vs LA differently than Calgary vs LA. Phoenix brings national attention even though the locals don't follow or watch their team. 

 

Ice hockey is just not a hot weather city sport. People don't connect with it or relate to it. But for the NHL it's important to have a team in a major US city like Phienox. It's better for the league as a whole. 

I think we all get what you're saying. BUT, this fiasco has been going on for over what 30 years, and they don't have an arena, but they've tried three of them for a period of time. If, and that's a big IF, Bettman had done his due diligence would all this negative crap continued? They've added franchises, moved franchises, but have always stayed the course in Glendale, Phoenix or Tempe. Please, tell me how many owners this franchise has had as well? So far it's not better for the league.

Edited November 5, 2023 by Johngould21

[Pure961089]

I just think this looks surreal. We all knew we had supremely talented players in all the areas you need to be an elite team.  It only took 3 coaches in as many years to find the right one with the right system and the right buy in.  And now... 

 

Edited November 5, 2023 by Pure961089

[Pure961089]

47 minutes ago, Googlie said:

 

Apparently we are 8 - 3 - 1.

 

Per Sportsnet we lost a phantom game to Calgary

Sportsnet didn't even post the Canucks Stars highlights last night.  

[Nucker67]

I'm a believer. This team is night and day from previous seasons. They're now a fast, physical team that will exhaust opponents, chasing the puck all night, and they're physical. Cole laying into Duchene with a crushing hit was a thing of beauty, and then handling Marchment. Finally, some swagger is back. "Don't fuck with the Canucks" should be the new mantra. I love that they aren't letting up at all this year. Even pounding San Jose 10-1 they weren't letting up. This team is hungry 60 minutes a game. I can imagine McDavid is not looking forward to taking his crap of a team into Vancouver against one nasty piece of business team like the Canucks. 

 

Also providing toughness are Miller, Lafferty, Soucy, Friedman and Joshua, and I really liked Hoglander's and Garland's grit. Maybe Beauvillier is the player they should trade. 

 

 

Edited November 5, 2023 by Nucker67

[Bob Long]

1 hour ago, Gawdzukes said:

 

It made good sense for them. They already have Seider which limits his upside and effectiveness as compared to playing him in Van with Hughes. Detroit has no one near Hughes ability on the second pairing. Detroit also has Edvinsson coming in and will have him and Seider eating all the minutes and they also won't have to deal with Hronek's contract and pay a #3 7 million+.

 

The trade actually is looking good for both sides as Detroit opted to sign a couple stop gap guys and that seems to be working out pretty well for them. I think Yzermessiah is planning on this team's peak coming in 2-3 years so he would also get ASP possibly entering on an ELC to replace Hronek's offence. They've got Willander and Buium as LD prospects as well and Gibson on RD.

 

Regardless of what Detroit is doing it's a great trade for us and is working out better than anyone expected. It really goes to show how important it was to get a player who can be on the same level as Hughes as compared to him carrying a guy like Schenn or Juulsen.

 

I was for playing them together but huge credit to @stawns who was adamant from day one that there was no reason that two non huge offensive guys couldn't work great together. I'am not sure even he expected them to be this good though.  Terrific stuff!

 

 

 

Yep seems like a rare win-win deal.

[DeNiro]

Just now, Pure961089 said:

Sportsnet didn't even post the Canucks Stars highlights last night.  

Neither did TSN. 

[Barn Burner]

17 minutes ago, Gawdzukes said:

Exactly. People get on this Bettman's team blah blah but I find they're missing the point completely which you've explained very well. You obviously want to try to grow the game across a country that size in order to maximize your product. It's a very reasonable strategy. It's unfortunate they've had so many struggles there of course but jumping ship wouldn't have necessarily been a grand slam or they would have moved on a long time ago.

Based on the 2023–2024 Nielsen rankings, Phoenix is the 11th largest TV market in the US. 

 

Although Atlanta, (6) and Houston, (7) don't have an NHL team. (obviously Atlanta tried twice, but...)

 

Regardless, it's been a joke of a franchise. Though, they are playing better this year. Let's see if the snowbirds jump on the bandwagon. 

[Gawdzukes]

26 minutes ago, AatuD2 said:

 

I get too what Yzerman was trying to do. He explained in his trade deadline press conference that Detroit wasn't at the same stage as Ottawa and Buffalo, they were a couple of years behind and would delay going for it. 

 

Yeah I do appreciate the ability to realize where they are in the cycle and have the patience and guts to make the right decisions even though the fanbase needs to be patient too as a result. I hope it's something we can actually do next time we are faced with a rebuild/retool.

[Ballisticsports]

17 minutes ago, AatuD2 said:

 

I get too what Yzerman was trying to do. He explained in his trade deadline press conference that Detroit wasn't at the same stage as Ottawa and Buffalo, they were a couple of years behind and would delay going for it. 

They don't want to make the same mistake our team had done and waste ELC and RFA contracts like we did and lowered our window to compete by overpaying 6-9 wingers an not building a team from D out 1st,

 

Do not get in a bidding war while being a bottom feeder, get your younger core surrounded by hard working honest journeymen (like Vegas had)

Construct a team with identity- It is all about timing, and we moved at least 2 yrs too fast and  will now have a shorter window to be a top team with paying for past mistakes in cap hits and higher pay to stars now

 

I am divided on holding onto stars forever for sentimental reasons like we did with the Sedins, Pitts with Crosby/Malkin, Wash Ovi- Your team is ok as they age and sell tickets, but not winning again as they age and are  highly paid- I think it is best to get younger great returns on their downside and speed up building another strong team, (Rental companies and fleet operators do the same, and sell before the mileage and age means they are no longer cost effective doing repairs to be profitable or reliable)

[stawns]

1 hour ago, MikeyD said:

They were far from mediocre but Vancouver made them look mediocre. Demko had to make a lot less difficult saves than Oettinger. Both teams played well but Vancouver's play was far superior. 

 

Realistically that game could have easily been 6-2. 

For the last two seasons, more often than not, a scramble in front of the Canucks net resulted in a goal as players stood around and watched.  To me, the biggest factor in last night's game (and season on the whole) hinged on the Canucks clearing pucks out in a scramble.  Last season Dallas would have put up a 5 or 6 spot based on scrambles alone.  To me, that's one of the biggest turn around for this club

[Pure961089]

24 minutes ago, Nucker67 said:

I'm a believer. This team is night and day from pervious seasons. They're now a fast, physical team that will exhaust opponents, chasing the puck all night, and they're physical. Cole laying into Duchene with a crushing hit was a thing of beauty, and then handling Marchment. Finally, some swagger is back. "Don't fuck with the Canucks" should be the new mantra. I love that they aren't letting up at all this year. Even pounding San Jose 10-1 they weren't letting up. This team is hungry 60 minutes a game. I can imagine McDavid is not looking forward to taking his crap of a team into Vancouver against one nasty piece of business team like the Canucks. 

 

Also providing toughness are Miller, Lafferty, Soucy, Friedman and Joshua, and I really liked Hoglander's and Garland's grit. Maybe Beauvillier is the player they should trade. 

 

 

Its hard to make a list of the many things the Canucks have going for them, and in what order?  Like the standards and being held accountable to those standards. We haven't had this level of accountability in over a decade.  Look at our coaching and development staff.  We had 8 coaches on the ice preparing the Canucks before the Dallas game.  Not just Tocchet, but the Sedins, Foote, Gonchar, Ian Clark, Higgins and Komisarek.  Anyone else notice the Sedin's hallmarks all over our powerplay?  And our PK. Ian Cole has been unbelievable.  All it took was a complete overhaul of our defensive core.  Hronek, Soucy, Cole and Friedman make this a totally different team on the back end. And the bottom 6, the additions of Lafferty, Suter, and Hoglander making the team and sticking, they have made this team so hard to play against.  Its the complete buy from the talent on this team that is making me believe.  Also it's the fact that every move Alvin made at the start of the season and in the off season has been magical. 

 

 

 

Edited November 5, 2023 by Pure961089

[Ghostsof1915]

2 hours ago, Roger Neilsons Towel said:

Our weakness is that we care too much.
The scars remind us that the past is real.

We tear Benning open just to feel. 

I hurt myself today....

To see if I still feel.....

[AatuD2]

11 minutes ago, Smashian Kassian said:

 

 

The problem with Drance is he's insufferably self-focused about it. It makes him annoying to listen too. Like I try to listen to their podcast sometimes & rarely can I get through half the show before I have to turn it off.

 

When it comes to the opinions, I do find there are often double standards that he tries to talk himself around & I disagree about your high expectations comment b/c I feel like he would be like this with any team he covers. For example the other day he was trying to say Anaheim is a good team (literally) and Jamie Dodd had to stop him in his tracks & point out their underlying numbers aren't good (isn't this the line of thinking Drance was using to undermine any success we've had the last few years?)

 

I appreciate his work, I even want to like him, and I enjoy when the times when I do agree completey, but.. he's trying to sell his hockey worldview to his readers & I don't find him to be the hockey genius he presents himself as. Infact I often wonder if some of his opinions are formed by going to natural stat-trick & working backwards. 

 

 

 

Anaheim Ducks have been Drance's wet dream for the last three years. 

He has said each year that they will be dangerous and not to discount them. 

 

Eventually he will be right and I do see them as our future rival, but in the meantime Drance makes predictions, sits on the fence, and awaits opportunities for Canucks to slip and yell that he was right. 

[AatuD2]

13 minutes ago, stawns said:

For the last two seasons, more often than not, a scramble in front of the Canucks net resulted in a goal as players stood around and watched.  To me, the biggest factor in last night's game (and season on the whole) hinged on the Canucks clearing pucks out in a scramble.  Last season Dallas would have put up a 5 or 6 spot based on scrambles alone.  To me, that's one of the biggest turn around for this club

 

 

I feel like that's got Adam Foote's name all over it. 

[stawns]

1 hour ago, Gawdzukes said:

 

It made good sense for them. They already have Seider which limits his upside and effectiveness as compared to playing him in Van with Hughes. Detroit has no one near Hughes ability on the second pairing. Detroit also has Edvinsson coming in and will have him and Seider eating all the minutes and they also won't have to deal with Hronek's contract and pay a #3 7 million+.

 

The trade actually is looking good for both sides as Detroit opted to sign a couple stop gap guys and that seems to be working out pretty well for them. I think Yzermessiah is planning on this team's peak coming in 2-3 years so he would also get ASP possibly entering on an ELC to replace Hronek's offence. They've got Willander and Buium as LD prospects as well and Gibson on RD.

 

Regardless of what Detroit is doing it's a great trade for us and is working out better than anyone expected. It really goes to show how important it was to get a player who can be on the same level as Hughes as compared to him carrying a guy like Schenn or Juulsen.

 

I was for playing them together but huge credit to @stawns who was adamant from day one that there was no reason that two non huge offensive guys couldn't work great together. I'am not sure even he expected them to be this good though.  Terrific stuff!

 

 

[Miss Korea]

1 hour ago, Rubik said:

LOL

 

 

 

 

THE MODEL IS FAILING

[Cali Canuck]

2 hours ago, Rip The Mesh said:

Awesome!!!!. The Rocket kicked butt. 

True story I was at his first game.  I'll never forget the end to end rushes he made.  He didn't score but everyone was in awe of his speed and skill. And we couldn't believe he on the Canucks.