[GDT] - November 15th 2023 - Canucks vs Islanders @ Rogers Arena - 7:00 PM PDT - SNP, AM650 - Bo-o Horvat Edition

[IBatch]

50 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Rumour was the offer we made to Fat Wallet was 49 mil (7x7). Thank goodness he said no. We dumperooed a problem (Fat Wallet is a 3C here) and turned him into an elite right shot D who was only 25. 
We won this trade. And it could have been so much worse if we kept Fat Wallet. We should all be thankful Fat Wallet said no to that 49 million. 

If we could of managed that,  we'd have a ridiculously deadly 3 lines...No Hronek though so things likely would be problematic for QHs and Demko.   In the end it worked out well for both teams and Horvat.  

[Mikeyman109]

I hope the boys put aside the Bo show and just go out and play a good game and get the win and two points. Im cheering for the guys that wear our jersey, not the ones that left. Two points tonight ties us for the lead in the conference. I will take that.Go Canucks Go

[IBatch]

As for Horvat.   So far he's scored 4 goals in 13 games, on his career trajectory to score half on the PP, half at even strength, in the mid 20's.   He's a minus one playing just under 20 minutes a game.   
 

Miller has 9 goals, 14 assists, 23 points in 15 games, a lot of them on the road too, is a plus 12 and playing just over 20 minutes a game.    He's also the leagues early favourite for the Selke, given Tochett is playing his line against the leagues best players.     No doubt a 125 point pace isn't sustainable ... but we've seen this from Miller before.    Guys got the "IT" factor every team wants.   Oh also at the same age Horvat is now, scored 99 points and that year he was on 3 different lines. 

 

Wonder if we kept the right guy?   All Miller has done since he's arrived, is be a star.    Hope this year, he's finally going to be fully recognized by this fanbase.   I'm sure NYR are sad we didn't take their offer. 

Edited November 15, 2023 by IBatch

[Boudrias]

56 minutes ago, IBatch said:

Nothing wrong with that.    I'm going to bet they offered Horvat a deal that some on this site wouldn't be that happy with.   A lot went wrong last year, that made it right for later.   Major surgery was required, and huge part of that surgery happened.   Also the way Miller ended up pitted against Horvat on the CDC, fans who felt Miller should have been the guy to trade, was being projected poorly.   Media driven.    I'm sure Horvat was a good teammate.   If the team wanted Horvat traded, they'd of done it without giving him their "best offer".   And given the deals handed out that summer and into the season,  it for sure was in Horvats bank account interest, to wait it out which he for sure did.   And was pad statting under Bruce.  

 

Kind of blew that the fans would pit Miller against Horvat, who to keep, while the team itself is working hard on signing him.    In the end maybe because the season was crap, the "unfinished work" was just hot air etc, Horvat was just the low hanging fruit.   Do have to wonder if Allvin was working on a Hronek trade prior to pulling the trigger on Horvat.    

 

Tochett is the man that deserves a ton of credit.   Bad habits, poor fitness levels, strength levels, he called it like it is.   QHs was the best choice for the next Captain as well.    Almost everything is falling into place for us right now.   Let's see how they manage EPs deal.    Seems like he's been offered the sun the moon and the stars already, that's what is coming out.    Hope he's just as serious as Miller is, in wanting to be a Canuck, and willing to take a pay cut to help make that happen.   That's leadership. 

Bo's era in Vancouver had many forces at work. As captain he was the beacon that Van fans focused on. IMHO Canuck fans of the era were always looking for the next savior would deliver the team to CUP play. Pretty much incidental if that team were truly CUP competitive or not. So not only did Bo have to play thru his own periodic 'dry' spells but had to answer for his team mates as well. As much as he could he tried to protect/shelter the younger players like Petey and Hughes. He had to deal with a management/owner who reflected the aspirations of the fans more than fundamental team building. 9 years is a long time. 

 

So I hope Bo Horvat is applauded when they show his video tribute. That would be a classy thing to do. Maybe fans expected more but that is more on the fans than Bo Horvat. On the ice he did his best and was better than most. If nothing else Rick Tocchet has shown us that the game has multiple levels of responsibility. Success does not come down to one player no matter the fan expectation.   

[AlwaysACanuckFan]

8 hours ago, PistolPete13 said:

That’s how you do it.

I’m sure that there will be a short tribute for Bo and we can applaud his past efforts for the team.

When the puck drops, that’s another story. If Bo sticks A Canuck then I’ll boo. Otherwise he’s just another guy wearing the wrong uniform.

We celebrate the short tribute with a win against the Islanders. 

Edited November 15, 2023 by AlwaysACanuckFan

[IBatch]

11 minutes ago, Boudrias said:

Bo's era in Vancouver had many forces at work. As captain he was the beacon that Van fans focused on. IMHO Canuck fans of the era were always looking for the next savior would deliver the team to CUP play. Pretty much incidental if that team were truly CUP competitive or not. So not only did Bo have to play thru his own periodic 'dry' spells but had to answer for his team mates as well. As much as he could he tried to protect/shelter the younger players like Petey and Hughes. He had to deal with a management/owner who reflected the aspirations of the fans more than fundamental team building. 9 years is a long time. 

 

So I hope Bo Horvat is applauded when they show his video tribute. That would be a classy thing to do. Maybe fans expected more but that is more on the fans than Bo Horvat. On the ice he did his best and was better than most. If nothing else Rick Tocchet has shown us that the game has multiple levels of responsibility. Success does not come down to one player no matter the fan expectation.   

Personally had very few expectations during his era.   The writing was on the wall.   Knew it was going to be a decade, maybe even two, before we'd see another cup contending team.   So was just enjoying the process, and really enjoyed the bubble.    Hilarious the expectations under Green were so high.   This team to me, would have been better off or on par, with expansion under the old rules (think CLB).    So don't include me at least as a fan who had those unrealistic expectations.   And well, i'd have preferred a Rick Nash, Dany Healtey or Kovulchuck over just a Horvat to start the process.      

 

Edit:  And yes for sure the fans should applaud Horvat.    And be classy.   At the same time if some boo birds come out while he touches the puck, that's ok too.   I wouldn't boo him personally.   But maybe i'd hackle him - try and throw him off his game.   "Miller's your Daddy!"   - "Hughes misses your bedtime! - Needs an hug!" after losing a draw "Hey I thought you were Good at faceoffs!".   Stuff like that.  I'd also ask him for an autograph during the warm -up and be persistent and thank him for his time with us and make him feel welcome.  Then say "you should have given me the autograph - Will say that for free!". 

 

So he knows who's heckling him before the game.   Horvat was a good player for us, we can welcome him back and then tease him all we want at the same time. 

 

Edited November 15, 2023 by IBatch

[-dlc-]

12 hours ago, Power-Forward said:

What’s the difference?  It’s just as disrespectful to boo anyone lol.  Where is the line in the sand drawn? 

It's sports.....jeering, trash talking is part of the FUN of being opponents. It doesn't have to be angry spirited....it's just how it is.

 

OUR former captain is different. I don't boo, period. 

 

With that, I think if people were to boo it would reflect badly in the team's eyes....to see the fans turn on a former player. We want players to want to play here....I don't know that booing after they've left lines up with that. We're better than that. Let's pretend Bo doesn't exist and focus on OUR team and cheering them on. Make Bo irrelevant.

[WeneedLumme]

12 hours ago, Power-Forward said:

“Former teammate”, and this isn’t about me.  They most likely aren’t friends now.  That’s the way business works sometimes. 

So in your mind, a player gives up all his friends every time a trade is made? I think you are projecting there. And anybody who thinks it is appropriate to boo him is demonstrating a clear lack of class.

[Rick_theRyper]

I always remember BOHO53 being the first bright spot during a dark time to be a Canucks fan, he'll be a good player for a long time still. Don't understand why a few crap on him so hard. Some special years there with him then Boeser, Petey, Hughes even Jake, all coming up looked we had some great pieces. Just never found the right bottom 6 or defensemen. Even back then thing could've gone a lot better with better UFA seasons. So many duds back then eating up 12-15 M a year it seemed.. back to reality. 

 

Canucks win this one, 5-3 ( Boeser empty net) 

[Bure10Kuzmenko96]

Can we please focus on Diwali night tonight and not Horvat? It's supposed to be a very happy festival and I always look forward to the celebrations being Hindu myself. Also, can we just win tonight!

[Lemon Face]

9 hours ago, Cromeslab said:

Tor will never allow this

That is why i said it would be dream

[Lemon Face]

39 minutes ago, -dlc- said:

It's sports.....jeering, trash talking is part of the FUN of being opponents. It doesn't have to be angry spirited....it's just how it is.

 

OUR former captain is different. I don't boo, period. 

 

With that, I think if people were to boo it would reflect badly in the team's eyes....to see the fans turn on a former player. We want players to want to play here....I don't know that booing after they've left lines up with that. We're better than that. Let's pretend Bo doesn't exist and focus on OUR team and cheering them on. Make Bo irrelevant.

OOOOOO Deb.To pretend he doesn't  exist is so much more mean.If you ask Bo ,he would tell you,Booo please Booo

[SV.]

It barely made sense to boo Kesler (all things considered), and it makes even less sense now to potentially boo Horvat.

There will be a time in the future when we can debate his leadership and comb through his tenure as the captain, but as far as I'm concerned, he doesn't warrant a negative response during the game, at this moment

He put up with lot of poor decision-making that was out of his control, and never hid from responsibilities and duties as the captain.  I mean, the talk of this team for the past week has been centered around how disjoined and chaotic the management has been since 2014, so why anybody could possibly point fingers to him is being needlessly and unfairly critical.  Also, the fact that new management chose to commit to Miller over him is not something to chastise him for, either.

Give him his tribute video during one of the stoppages of play and then win the game.  Simple as.

Just now, SV. said:

It barely made sense to boo Kesler (all things considered), and it makes even less sense now to potentially boo Horvat.

There will be a time in the future when we can debate his leadership and comb through his tenure as the captain, but as far as I'm concerned, he doesn't warrant a negative response during the game, at this moment

He put up with lot of poor decision-making that was out of his control, and never hid from responsibilities and duties as the captain.  I mean, the talk of this team for the past week has been centered around how disjoined and chaotic the management has been since 2014, so why anybody could possibly point fingers to him is being needlessly and unfairly critical.  Also, the fact that new management chose to commit to Miller over him is not something to chastise him for, either.

Give him his tribute video during one of the stoppages of play and then win the game.  Simple as.

Of course, also enjoy the evening's festivities, as well

[JayDangles]

I wouldn't worry much people. The fans won't boo Horvat. The atmosphere isn't conducive to booing when the big screen is paying tribute. 

Look at Kesler, he absolutely ham strung the team with his trade request and left on bad terms, and nobody boo'd him.

It's all good. Folks will cheer for Horvat for 30 seconds and move on.

 

[Barnstorm]

16 minutes ago, JayDangles said:

I wouldn't worry much people. The fans won't boo Horvat. The atmosphere isn't conducive to booing when the big screen is paying tribute. 

Look at Kesler, he absolutely ham strung the team with his trade request and left on bad terms, and nobody boo'd him.

It's all good. Folks will cheer for Horvat for 30 seconds and move on.

 

100% correct. 
Much ado about nothing.

[EdgarM]

13 hours ago, PhillipBlunt said:

While I’m very happy with where the team is now, I fail to see how Horvat forced a trade out of Vancouver. He only got the big payday AFTER he was traded which was a choice (and the correct one) made by Alvin and Rutherford. 

When he was no longer discussing his contract and just wanted to concentrate on the season? I knew he wasn't happy with what was being offered to him. The writing was on the wall. He thought he was a top center and wanted to be paid as such. Petey on the other hand, I hope his intentions are different and he is more concerned about winning as opposed to how many zeros are going to be added to his paycheck. We shall see soon I guess either way.

[JayDangles]

Go Canucks Go!

These are games we need to win. Early in the season home games against lesser teams on a big road trip. 2 points in November is worth 3 points in March! Hopefully they keep their feet on the gas and Pacific teams in the rearview mirror.

[snowman955]

11 hours ago, Barnstorm said:

I wasn’t suggesting the fans should be there. 
If two NHL teams can’t come close to filling the lower bowl I’d say there’s a problem with the product and the location. These are Bettman’s pet projects, they’re not strong hockey markets, fair weather only. 

This did happen in ottawa during the Melnyk Era. The complete 300 level was blank.

This has since been corrected by Andlauer.

[JayDangles]

A win tonight lands us in top spot in the Pacific! Wow!

[Ghostsof1915]

6 minutes ago, JayDangles said:

A win tonight lands us in top spot in the Pacific! Wow!

All I care about is, as long as we stay above the playoff line.

[Barnstorm]

6 minutes ago, Ghostsof1915 said:

All I care about is, as long as we stay above the playoff line.

We’re in great shape so far. 
US thanksgiving being considered an important bench mark is fast approaching. In or out at that time is generally a good indicator of positioning. 

[CanucksJay]

29 minutes ago, EdgarM said:

When he was no longer discussing his contract and just wanted to concentrate on the season? I knew he wasn't happy with what was being offered to him. The writing was on the wall. He thought he was a top center and wanted to be paid as such. Petey on the other hand, I hope his intentions are different and he is more concerned about winning as opposed to how many zeros are going to be added to his paycheck. We shall see soon I guess either way.

 

Funny how the tide has turned but I hope he looks at JTs contract, sees that JT takes all the hard matchups while still putting up tons of points and is signed @ 8m. He then looks over and sees Quinn making 7.85 while being the team captain and top d man in the NHL. Albeit, quinn went for security earlier on in his career so its not really comparable but to win the cup, players can't be trying to maximize their personal net worth. 

Look at all the top heavy teams, they don't win the cup. Need depth through the lineup. 

One thing that scares me about Petey is that he continually bets on himself and takes maximum amounts on short term contracts. I'm really hoping he's not doing all this to set himself up for a crazy 8 year max payday. 

If he leaves a little money on the table, that's the difference in the quality of a 6D we can get. A cup calibre one or a waiver fodder. 

 

Its also equally important for management not to waste money on stupid signings. If I was Petey and I saw oel making 7m, Brock of old (not this year) making almost 7m, why would I take a discount? So that they can overpay a teammate that's not pulling their weight? 

If the team is firing on all cylinders and they are all playing up to their contracts, it would be easier to convince Petey to be a team player. 

[Gawdzukes]

31 minutes ago, EdgarM said:

When he was no longer discussing his contract and just wanted to concentrate on the season? I knew he wasn't happy with what was being offered to him. The writing was on the wall. He thought he was a top center and wanted to be paid as such. Petey on the other hand, I hope his intentions are different and he is more concerned about winning as opposed to how many zeros are going to be added to his paycheck. We shall see soon I guess either way.

 

I think this is total BS obviously showing negative bias. He thought he was a good player and deserved market value. He was being seriously undervalued with the reported offer. As mentioned by another poster he only capitalized due to the Isles situation once he was randomly traded there.

 

Being mad at our last 10 years is understandable, blaming Bo for that is not. Petey is not taking a discount to make anyone happy imo, and nor should he.

[Mr Wes]

21 hours ago, JoGuitar said:

Having gone through the Pavel Bure, and Ryan Kesler departures I usually err on the side of Vancouver being pretty polite to its former long serving members.

 

He apologized for his comments, I think we can all move on.

Agree, only  people with low self-esteem will feel the urge to boo for Bo who stood up for the team during an all but glorious period.

[Bob Long]

2 minutes ago, Gawdzukes said:

 

I think this is total BS obviously showing negative bias. He thought he was a good player and deserved market value. He was being seriously undervalued with the reported offer. As mentioned by another poster he only capitalized due to the Isles situation once he was randomly traded there.

 

Being mad at our last 10 years is understandable, blaming Bo for that is not. Petey is not taking a discount to make anyone happy imo, and nor should he.

 

its pretty clear we would have needed to overpay him to keep him here tho. The right decision was made for everyone at the end of the day.